@Rainbowuni, in case you didn’t get a chance to read my last comment on #100hardthings, I asked you to explain what you meant when you said that people who are anti-abortion support forced organ donation. But I didn’t want that thread to get overwhelmed with different topics so I asked you to post it here 🙂 Thank you!
All other lovely PI’ers, we’re having a pretty good conversation about Trump and Clinton on the #100hard things thread (it starts on pg 6). Head over and check it out if you want! I’d love to hear other people’s opinions.
|August 31, 2016 at 20:11|
I completely understand wanting to move to a new topic, that one already moved off topic, no sense changing the discussion twice 😀
By forced organ donation, I meant that not allowing a woman the right to an abortion, she is being forced to donate her uterus (as well as the rest of her body) to the fetus. My pro-choice stance is simply that women should not be required to become human incubators against their will.
|August 31, 2016 at 20:47|
(This is excludes rape victims and women who had no choice In their their intamacy.)
|August 31, 2016 at 21:38|
Ah, I see. I disagree, but I think we discussed this last summer so I won’t go into my views on it again.
@Juanita I agree! I also think providing better access to contraception (insisting on abstinence doesn’t really work, since a lot of people aren’t Christian and don’t agree) and more support for pregnant and new mothers would help prevent abortions as well.
|August 31, 2016 at 21:46|
@Juanita Driving is also a choice, and death can be a result of that. But if someone hits another car and kills the driver, they’re still charged with manslaughter–because driving isn’t consenting to death, right? Or, if you’re in a car accident and are in need of medical attention, you expect to receive that medical attention, correct? Because being in a car is not consenting to dying without medical attention. Similarly, having sex is not consenting to pregnancy.
|August 31, 2016 at 22:10|
Yes it IS agreement to children. Children are a NATURAL result of sex, but death isn’t a natural result of driving. I TOTALLY agree with Juanta. If anybody is against the murder of innocent children, they should be pro life. The child matters just as much as the mother.
|September 1, 2016 at 03:24|
If your kidney is donated, you aren’t going to get that kidney back. If you’re pregnant, you’re going to “get your uterus back” after around 9 months. You really can’t compare the two, imho.
Plus, as Juanita said, you already made the choice (of course with the exception of rape victims). You had the choice to have sex. In my opinion, your *choice* has already been made. If you’re going to have sex, you need to realize that pregnancy is always a possible outcome, and you need to be ready for that (emotionally, financially, etc)!
Something about this thread really bothers me. With pregnancy, (as long as you have access to medical care) you have doctors and other medical professionals who have your and your baby’s health and overall well being as priorities. If your organs are being taken from you against your will, I can pretty much guarantee you that those organ traffickers wouldn’t care in the slightest if you were in excruciating pain, if you got a terrible infection, or if you died. Sure, pregnancy isn’t the easiest thing in the world, but at least you have people who care.
And a bit of a side note–I think a woman should have the right to an abortion if her life is at risk; we need to consider what’s best for both mom and baby in the long term…but obviously that’s a very personal decision that should be made by the mother.
|September 1, 2016 at 09:05|
@theteenfashionista I simply disagree with that. People have sex for many reasons, children aren’t the only one. It’s human nature, and happens with many animal species as well. If the intent was not to get pregnant, and especially if precautions were taken to avoid this, having sex is not consenting to being pregnant for 9 months. It’s also not consent to any number of STDs, which is why we have treatments for so many of them.
“The child matters just as much as the mother.”
@Nino okay, replace “kidney” with “blood,” if that makes you feel better. Why is a mother not EVER required to give blood to her child *after* it’s born? Blood and platelets regenerate after a few weeks–just a fraction of the 40 weeks of pregnancy. And we’ve already established she made the decision to have sex, therefore consenting to both pregnancy and the resulting children. So, if her biological child would die without her blood, why is she allowed to stand back and say, “I don’t want to give up my body for this child,” when she’s not allowed to do the same for a child in utero?
If you’re pregnant against your will, however, you still get medical care despite your organs being taken from you against your will. It’s sort of a weird overlap. Besides, not all pregnant women have access to (or can afford) such great healthcare.
How much “at risk” must her life be in order to get to make the choice, though? All pregnancies carry *some* risk. Is that enough? Or must pregnancy mean certain death for a woman–as deemed by…one doctor? Two? 500?–in order for the right to make this choice to open up to her? Just a thought.
|September 1, 2016 at 10:04|
@nino99 I TOTALLY AGREE.
|September 1, 2016 at 10:25|
But that’s ultimately what happens, correct? The child gets killed if she makes that choice. Why should anyone get to decide to kill an innocent child? (Unless, of course, they’re the government and a relative of a terrorist. Then it’s okay.)
I know plenty about it–my sister nearly died carrying her second child, as a direct result of the pregnancy. I know people who have been in similar situations, some hospitalized for weeks… Some pregnancies are simply more dangerous. Don’t act as if your mother represents ALL women. I’m glad her pregnancies worked out well for her. That’s unfortunately not the case for everyone.
|September 1, 2016 at 10:49|
@rainbowuni You seem very bitter.
|September 1, 2016 at 11:14|
@theteenfashionista I could say the same about you.
|September 1, 2016 at 11:26|
Well I’m not, though you must think I have a twisted worldview, that’s what I see in you.
|September 1, 2016 at 11:51|
I don’t think you have a “twisted” worldview, but I honestly do not understand it and I’m trying to. Do you think I have twisted worldview?
|September 1, 2016 at 12:07|
rainbowuni- I wonder (I mean I genuinely wonder–I’m not being sarcastic or anything), would your views on this be different if there was more support (medically, but also psychological/emotional) offered to mothers (regardless of how much they can or cannot pay) after the child is born? I’ve thought about that quite often–that it seems like the pro-life movement is focused only on preventing abortion but doesn’t necessarily stand up for those lives once their out of the womb…and it seems like you’re getting at that here too.
|September 1, 2016 at 14:13|
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